Heavy metal, a brand of music as well as a lifestyle for millions of people across the globe, is somewhat of a confusing entity. Its often dark trappings and rebellious nature can be a little daunting for some, as can the sheer aural brutality of its skilled performers. Therefore, people tend to take this healthy, natural outlet for aggression or hyperactivity and blame it for everything under the sun. Teen suicide. Animal abuse. Devil worship. And now, biological warfare.

But the name of metal patriarch Scott Ian (Rosenfeld)’s band Anthrax has been raising eyebrows over twenty years before the post 9/11 white powder scare.
Scott explains, “Generally, when someone who is completely outside the world of this type of music hears the name, you get this look of ‘Huh, Anthrax?’�

So he tells people, “Oh, we’ve had (the name) since 1981� when he founded the band with several classmates in Flushing, Queens. Scott, a shiny headed, goateed, tattooed 5 foot 7 wiry Tazmanian devil of a guitarist/lyricist/producer/Mel Brooks fan chose the name after hearing it in a high school biology class.

And since its conception, Anthrax has been established as one of the premier metal bands of all time. They are responsible for influencing myriads of bands and musicians from international legends to school-age air-guitar virtuosos. They even had a street named after them in Texas (though some of the residents are trying to get the name changed because of its unsavory connotations). On their latest critically acclaimed release, “We’ve Come For You All,� the CD’s inlay depicts the band standing after a show together in overalls with the words “We Are Not Changing Our Name.�

Anthrax, who once shared living quarters with anti-Napster activists Metallica in Yonkers (Scott’s a rabid Yankees fan but that wasn’t why he lived there) when both bands were rising to fame, has nine full studio albums and countless other releases.

Though many of their other lesser-known releases are considered to be of better quality and more influential in the metal world, commercially and in a cross-genre sense they are most noted for their 1985 old school hip-hop influenced “I Am The Man� and groundbreaking collaboration with rap artists Public Enemy on that group’s “Bring the Noise.� These songs helped initiate what is now one of the top-selling breeds of music at this time, a sort of rap/metal hybrid that the record companies seem to fawn over at the expense of musical integrity.

Born December 31st, 1963 to Jewish but unaffiliated parents who stressed the importance of open-mindedness, freedom and good family communication, Scott grew up a couple of miles from Hollis, Queens where the whole rap scene was breaking out.
He recalls, “At the time “I Am The Man� was a basically very good reflection of the music we were listening to – when we wrote that we were just doing that out of our love for music. Our label wanted us to do another rap song but we weren’t into it.�

“I Am The Man� went gold, made the UK Top Ten and during this time, Anthrax headlined sold out tours in the States, Europe and Japan (they had toured most of the world on countless occasions before, either headlining or in support of bands like KISS). Anthrax’s other foray into the rap genre was also pretty lucrative but Scott asserts that “I’m not going to do something halfassed to try and get some of that rap money.

“When we did the Public Enemy song, leaving Island and going to Elektra, a lot of it was based on the song with Public Enemy. But that was the peak in ‘91 and ‘92. There was nothing we could have done better than that. It’s been 12 years. If I would have had an idea I thought was anywhere near what we did with Bring the Noise I would do it. Believe me, I wish I had a head full of ideas for that stuff but it’s not where I come from creatively.�

In any case, Anthrax is doing better business than it has in ten years and their tour to promote “We Have Come For You All,� which Scott describes as a combination of the records Anthrax has made up until this point,� has been successful beyond their expectations. “It’s a better time for this music now.� They’ve been there since the beginning of the metal era and though their sound has become less focused on speed and more on groove, their musical prowess refuses to be denied.

That’s because Anthrax has “the same attitude going into every record. We try to make the best record we can make, to be excited about playing the songs ‘till we’re sick of them, trying to come up with ideas that will give us a big kick in the ass. We’re the biggest fans of this kind of music and we’re the biggest Anthrax fans. The whole challenge of creating music and lyrics is that every time we finish a record I’m like ‘What if the well’s dry?’ but a year will go by, we’ll start working and realize, ‘Wow, we’ve got something really cool here.’

“On “We Have Come For You All,� we knew really quickly we had something good. Usually we write more than we need. This time, there wasn’t one song we felt didn’t belong on the record.�

Anthrax’s metal mastery was partly forged in the fire breathed from Gene Simmons’ mouth. KISS, whose songs Anthrax regularly covers (one of which they produced themselves for the tribute album Kiss My Ass), was the catalyst for it all. When Scott saw KISS in 1977 at Madison Square Garden – “everything changed. I knew that this was what I wanted to do with my life.� He also remembers seeing the Who on TV at age 11 or 12 and thinking it was the coolest thing he’d ever seen. His uncle was also a major influence, getting Scott into comic books (which are an integral part of Anthrax paraphernalia and lyrical content), Black Sabbath and Frank Zappa.

Scott didn’t really have any Jewish education though he definitely identifies – he’s known to sometimes sign his e-mails as “The Jew.� Says he, “I’m Jewish, it’s a part of my life, it’s part of my upbringing, but I wasn’t raised obviously Jewish.� He never really had to do anything he didn’t want to do so when a lot of his friends started going to Jew school he opted out.

He remembers going down to Florida to visit his Orthodox grandfather. “He would take us to synagogue with him once or twice. We would stand there with yarmulkes on and be really bored and want go back to the swimming pool.� And he recalls that he only got his bar mitzvah to make his grandfather happy and that “it made him really happy.� But “I’m not involved in any way with any organized religion. I’m sure it’s a part of my makeup and there are traditions I respect and enjoy but on a day-to-day basis…I’m open-minded. I don’t know a lot of that stuff.�

Scott and his girlfriend Pearl now live in a religious LA neighborhood. “Safe Home,� which at the time this article is being written is the number one request on 94.7 in Chicago, is dedicated to her.

And speaking of safe homes, Scott has what to say on the whole terror situation in regards to his role as an entertainer.

“We give people an outlet to have fun. We give people and opportunity just to enjoy themselves, put away cares and responsibilities for an hour and a half. That’s what it’s always been about for me. What we do as bands is such a small little dot in the grand scheme of things but when (terror attacks happen at concerts)….Last time we went to South America and Venezuela the promoters called and said “We cannot guarantee the band’s safety.� I hate that. We as entertainers should be able to bring what we do everywhere and we can’t and it pisses me off.�

A lot of his lyrics in songs such as “Refuse To Be Denied� address the fact that he won’t change his life or give up his freedoms. “Proud and free, that’s American to me, that’s a human thing. Freedom is every human’s birthright and there are people trying to give that away. Because I don’t subscribe to Osama Bin Laden’s believe as far as he’s concerned I’m an infidel and I should die. I don’t live in his world and I don’t believe. I wish people could find other motivations than ‘this is the word of G-d telling them this is the right and only way.’ G-d is personal to me. It has nothing to do with the way other people think. To me, being in love is my G-d. That’s what drives me. If He/She/It put this
in my life then thank You and praise all day long.�

And thank You for Anthrax, too.

BTW: This picture was done as a joke like, six or seven years ago. Recently, Pete’s come out with a wonderful little ditty where he states that all the Jews need to convert to Xtianity and that Israel is a self-proclaimed state. After you read this interview, check out my response to him here.

This interview was done back in the day when he was still hot.

A: What does a producer do?

P: A producer shines a piece of coal into a diamond or attempts to do that…meaning that nowadays, a producer will work with a young band.and producers seem to think that they are know-it-alls and it is their job to make the band sound as good as possible…meaning they kind of trim the fat because younger bands have a habit of being repetitious with riffs and stuff and y’know, their songs are pretty long so in essence of Type O Negative just like that.. they just try to direct the band and try to get the best sound that they possibly can and try to highlight the band’s few good points and to hide the band’s many bad points.

A: So what exactly does a reproducer do?

P: A reproducer is someone who has sex with women and attempts to expand his gene pool.

A: In regards to your album? (giggles)

P: Oh, I see. That was just kind of a stupid joke because Josh and I have a habit of not agreeing how my songs should sound so after he goes and does what he thinks is right I go back and I do what I know is right.

A: Normally you write everything, right?

P: That is correct.

A: So on World Coming Down, I heard the band had more input. Why’d you decide to change the process?

P: The band had more input during the mix. Not really during the actual writing of the songs. And like an idiot, I tried to make everyone happy and in doing so, not only did I make no one happy, because then it became like one big argument but I made myself most unhappy. So this is not something I’m going to attempt again. There’s an old saying ‘Too many cooks spoil the broth.’ Well, our soup is full of maggots.

P: I’m very interested to find out, like, how you know my opinions about fire (see elemental comparison).

A: Oh forget it, I read everything.

P: I didn’t know that it was common knowledge that I’m like a pyromaniac.

A: Of course! Anyone who.you could say I’m a connoisseur of the Type O Negative. I don’t know, I read up on you guys.

P: Well actually, the correct title is not pyromaniac, it’s called pyrolagnia (spells it) Something like that. What it means is ‘fire lust.’ It’s like a sexual response to something that should not really be sexual.

A: Why not?

P: I don’t know. I have only heard about like a handful of people who were, I’m not going to say afflicted but who had the same reaction to fire as I do so I guess it’s pretty abnormal but I guess as long as it doesn’t hurt anyone it really doesn’t make a difference. I mean I’m not going down and burning apartment buildings or old people or anything like that.

A: I guess the pyrolagnia is what ‘Pyretta Blaze’ is all about.

P: Yeah, exactly. It’s about me having sex with a female pyromaniac while she’s starting a fire. One of the other things I find very sexual too is when women smoke, but I guess that’s on the Internet as well- I don’t know.

A: What do you think’s the reason society tends to blame music and those who make it for its problems?

P: Because rock bands are an easy target. They’re notoriously flashy, and they project the views of the youth which is virtually condoning irresponsibility and condoning the notion that young people are just poor, poor victims of the modern age. And so, as an older person nowadays I guess I kind of blame some of the rock bands for some of the evils of society like drug use, promiscuity and stuff like that. But, you know, I’m turning into my father nowadays. We’re not the type of band that condones these things. We don’t condemn it either, because we don’t want to turn people off but in essence what I’m saying is we’re the type of band that says if you’re f**ked up, it’s not the fault of the government or the city or your parents or the church or the school. You’re f**ked up because you’re irresponsible, and if you want to blame somebody look in the mirror. There are no victims, there are only volunteers.

A: What were your reactions and feelings when it was you in particular?

P: Well, we were kinda singled out for all the wrong reasons. I’ve got a big mouth and am politically incorrect and I’m very proud of it. Just the word politically correct irritates me because I don’t want to be told by anyone or any entity like the media what I should believe or what is right or what is wrong, y’know.my opinions are not based upon hearsay, my opinions are based upon life experience and so when we were accused of being fascists and communists and Satanists it kind of did us a huge favor because it generated so much press and it increased record sales.

A: Back to the rock music being a reflection of what’s going on with the kids, do you think that most rock groups now try to cater to that and that’s not really them?

P: I think that probably most of the rock groups cater to it because that’s how they really feel but I think that the media and the record companies and certain other entities know that what these bands are preaching is wrong. However, they don’t care because they’re going to make a huge profit off of it. So in essence, it is these capitalist ideals that are destroying the youth, not so much the bands, because unless the band has a springboard and some way to convey their message, they would never be heard.

A: Why don’t you play the older stuff anymore?

P: You’re saying off of Slow, Deep and Hard?

A: Yeah.

P: That was ten years ago. I’m not going to say that I think that I’m a much different person, but I think it was kind of vulgar and like that song, “I Know You’re F**king Someone Else,” I thought it was funny, and a big joke and yeah, it had a lot of shock effect. But now looking back, I really cringe when I think about writing that song because it was so Neanderthal. But this next tour that we’re doing, we’re going to play two or three songs probably off of each album because now we’ve got four albums to work from, and we’re going to do a couple of different covers and stuff, so.

A: What covers are you going to do?

P: What we’re thinking of is “Bad Moon Rising,” by.

A: Creedence.

P: But like a hardcore version of it, sped up a little bit.

A: You slowed it down last time, I remember.

P: No actually, we did it really fast, and then the last verse, it was slow. So this is going to be the same song. I just think it’s good, you know, for the Halloween season. What else? What else am I thinking about doing.maybe Cinnamon Girl, or maybe a Beatles song, I don’t know—

A: “Day Tripper” (on the new album, World Coming Down) is very nice.

P: Yeah, I like it, I just don’t think it’s a good live song cause it is kinda slow and virtually eighty percent of all the material we’re going to be doing is really slow. I wanted to get some uplifting songs in there.

A: True or false: In your previous material- Carnivore/Retaliation/ Slow, Deep, and Hard you used the music to let out an intense mess of pain and feeling, like you said, it’s sonic therapy for you. But people took it way too personal–

P: That’s true.

A: — and used it as a reflection of themselves and you didn’t like it-

P: Right.

A: And that’s why you changed your style.

P: Uh, I didn’t change my style intentionally. I changed my style because I changed as a person. You know, I think that I got over being pissed off at the world. Then with Bloody Kisses, when the band I think really found its style, I didn’t expect there to be such a sexual response and for someone who has always felt really insecure about his appearance and always wanted friendship, especially the companionship of women, this was like finding gold buried in your own back yard.

A: And that album went gold, too.

P: Yeah, that was a fortunate accident. I mean, I was working for the Parks Dept. at the time and I just wrote these songs, like not really thinking that anything would happen with it, and then all of a sudden I was just getting these great responses, and I just couldn’t believe it.

A: Is that why you made October Rust very sexy?

P: Yeah, I think all the attention went to my head a little bit but looking back at it, I think we’ve made our point. That’s why this new album is not really sexual at all except for one song, “Pyretta Blaze,” and that’s it. So instead of writing eight or ten songs about chasing some poor girl around in the woods, I’d just wrote some songs about looking for myself in the woods.

A: It’s a great album.

P: Thank you.

A: Why do you think that in the past people have had such a strong reaction to you?

P: I think it’s because we’re a very emotional, passionate band, we don’t mince words, we don’t mix words, I mean if I got something to say, generally I say it. I mean, even though I like goth music I was never really influenced by it, but now I see why a lot of goth people like us. If you mix up sexuality, religion, death, and love, it comes out to a very interesting product at the end. I mean you throw in some fire, and some blood, and well, there ya go. It was not contrived-I was not trying to be goth or anything like that, I’ve just always been a romantic, morbid person, and having been raised Catholic and stuff.

A: Sorry.

P: Me too. You know, all the ingredients were there.

A: What did you start Type O Negative with the intentions of doing and where do you see it going now?

It started because I was bored. Type O Negative was formed after my former band Carnivore broke up, and I did not even touch my bass for two years. Literally. I did not play my bass for two years. It’s ironic that Sal [Abruscato, former drummer of Type O now with Life Of Agony] came over my house one night and uh, it’s ironic that he wound up quitting after getting the band all together and stuff. We just went with it from there, and then a hobby turned into a career. The intention was sonic therapy, it was just something to do after work a couple of days a week. I like writing songs, it was very interesting for me to work with the band and to put all of my feelings, and sweat and blood and semen.

A: That’s how you signed your contract [with Roadrunner Records, in a mixture of blood and semen]?

P: That was a rumor.

A: Was it true?

P: No it was a rumor. Everything’s a rumor about us.

A: Where do you see Type O going now, with all the rumors about you breaking up (voice cracks in sorrow)?

P: I don’t know. I just mentioned to you, when Type O Negative was first formed that there was a lot of pleasure in songwriting and recording and working with the band. It seems that, well, every day that passes by I’m getting less and less pleasure out of it because there are too many entities involved. You know, I’m not a control freak, but these are my songs and I have definite ideas about how they should be recorded and mixed. I also enjoy putting all the art together for the CD packaging and posters and whatnot, and now between the label, the band, myself, management, and butting-in girlfriends and wives who give their opinions when they’re not asked, it’s not even my band anymore. I don’t like being told what to do, I don’t like having anything that comes out of me creatively being tampered with. Not that I feel it’s so precious or so beautiful, but it’s mine. This is like having a child and someone coming in and telling you how to dress your child. My response would be, of course, “F-k you.” But this is not something that happened overnight. This is something.if someone steals something from you every day without you noticing it one day you’re going to walk into the house and you’re going to realize you’ve been totally wiped out. And you’re going to say “Wow, I didn’t even see this happening,” and it was happening really slowly. So, that’s kinda what is going on here. So now I’ve learned to say no to people, and I must say that saying no to people feels much better than yes. I think Mae West said it the best when she said that “One of the ways that you know that you’re successful is when people tell you that you’re difficult to work with.” And so, I’m not going to say that I’m difficult, I just know what I want, and I don’t want advice unless I ask for it, I don’t want suggestions, I don’t need it. I don’t want input. I mean, you know, it’s either going to be done my way or I am prepared to walk. It’s not to say that I’m going to stop making music, I just should not call any future projects if I left Type O Negative Type O Negative. I was thinking about doing a side project but I don’t know when I’ll have the time. We just worked on a video over the weekend-

A: For Everything Dies, right?

P: Yeah. And this is one of the other problems too. We sit home for a year doing nothing, and then all of a sudden the shit hits the fan and I try to do four different jobs at once for six months. It’s like, why doesn’t somebody from the label or management because they’re being paid for it, why don’t they figure out my time for me because that’s their job. Why on video shoots am I doing interviews on cellphones? And my having meetings with stage designers, and drawing sets, and being called back to the shoot, and not being able to eat lunch or sit down to have something to drink, and you know, this is virtually how every day has been for the last six months. People sometimes say that I’m a constant complainer. A complainer is someone who just starts talking when he or she is not even asked how they feel. I don’t start so-called complaining until someone says, “How’s it going?” and I’ll be like, “Well do you really want to know?” And during the course of interviews, I’m not going to make believe that everything’s great, everything’s happy. I’m not happy doing this.

A: (babbles something ) Sorry to interrupt.

P: No, that’s OK. I think I was finished complaining.

A: It’s OK. Believe me. I wasn’t worried about it. My ear is open.

P: That’s fine.

A: What’s the video gonna be like?

P: Well of course it’s “Everything Dies.” The song itself is about.over the last 3-5 years I’ve lost quite a few important family members. And I’m not going to say I’m obsessed with death but it just seems that I am surrounded by it and it’s really hard for me to get a break from it. So I wrote a song about it, and it’s about the death of my father, my uncle, and my aunt. So what’s going to be shown are like various family members sitting around the table and every time the camera goes back to the scene, there’s another family member gone. So that’s kind of like what happened with me, every time I would see my family would be around Thanksgiving or Christmas and you know, every year the table would get smaller and smaller, and now it seems I only get to see my family members when I go to the funeral. Sometimes when I go see them, they’re in the box.

A: That song made me cry.

P: Well, it was really difficult for me to do this video cause there were certain lines I had to say over and over and over again. And, uh.

A: I don’t understand how you can do it.

P: I didn’t think that this song would be the first video, or ever a video.

A: (thinking) It was the record company.

P: It was a joint decision between management, the band, and the label. The next song that I would like to do a video for is “Pyretta Blaze.” That should be pretty interesting. I don’t know how these ideas would be conveyed because the whole thing is about a woman smoking and burning things, and those are two things you can’t show on MTV. You know, they don’t even want you to show fire in like, any kind of destructive or what is perceived to be destructive sense.

A: Really.

P: Yeah. Like when we did the “Girlfriend’s Girlfriend” video the original version was having these two women sharing a cigarette which I think is very sexy, but ultimately it was very phallic too, and when we presented the video to MTV they rejected it because of that scene.

A: What is this?

P: Uhh. I find it, well, very hypocritical because any time I see Slash on MTV he’s always got a cigarette stuck in his mouth and I mean, I’ve seen other videos.I just saw one recently that was actually really pretty, where a girl was smoking and she was blowing bubbles with the smoke.it was really very interesting. She had one of those kiddie bubble wands and she was exhaling smoky bubbles.so.it kinda comes down to the fact that Roadrunner Records doesn’t have the political pull that someone like Slash does or David Bowie or, or.Madonna. not even so much them as people but the weight of their record labels like Warner or, you know, any of the other types. Roadrunner Records sends this forthcoming video to MTV, I think they should enclose a blank check or a kilo of cocaine or something cause I think that’s how things are done anyway it seems. It’s like who you know, or who you’re f**kin’, or who you party with, you know. If you owe someone favors, this is how the whole thing works. Or, if MTV or VH1 or whatever entity feels they have something to gain or profit from by playing your video, that’s the only reason they’re going to play it. That’s why I don’t watch MTV, because it’s all trendy shit, you know. All white guys trying to be black.

this photo was shamelessly pilfered from the Metal Factory.

On Brooklyn:

“Concrete and assholes. I guess the band has an urban feel to it in some ways, I guess Brooklyn is a very sarcastic and negative place, I guess some of that has bled over to us, but I don’t think we would have been much different if we were brought up in Iowa. The band, that is.”

On Being Around the World:

“Once you get to know people they’re all coming from the same place. Cultures may differ a bit…the most alien experience I’ve ever had was in Budapest. I couldn’t sleep, it was in my hotel room five in the morning. The sun was coming up. And there was this really strange music coming over the rooves. It was going on and on. “Damn, where the hell is this music coming from?” So I got dressed and left my hotel, and I followed the sound of the music. I turned the corner, and it was this wedding! It had to be like two square city blocks, 3000 people there. The cake was like a story high. So I say, “What the hell, I crashed the wedding, I walked in, I took a couple beers off a plate and they had the bride up on a pedestal and everyone was dancing around with her. She looked like she was sixty years old. There was a bunch of bridesmaids or something giggling and laughing and looking at me and all of a sudden these two guys came up to me and with these strange accents they said “Who invited you?” and I said “Nobody! I just walked in off the street!” and they threw me out. It was a gypsy wedding. It was so strange. These people have a 2000 year old look to them, you know?”

The Legend of the Molotov Cocktail Show:

“It was in Stuttgart. That was years ago, man, that’s gotta be eight years ago. We were playing and somebody called in a bomb scare to cause a hoax and they stopped us in the middle of our set, they evacuated the whole club, they brought bomb squads and dogs and stuff. They didn’t find anything so we resumed the show. It was really strange. We had a bunch of radical left wings after us over there. They were after anyone they could get their hands on at the time in Germany. This one was a fascist, this one was a racist, this one was this…it was just a lot of political uncertainty and upheaval over there. It was right before [the Berlin Wall came down] or right after it I think, I have a piece of the Wall though. I’m not sure if it was a real piece or not, but the guy was selling them, so…”

Why Type O Garners Such Strong Reactions:

“People need something to throw darts at. Something to resent. Something to look forward to, up to. Something larger than themselves. I don’t believe we’re larger that anyone, but the human imagination blows things up to something they’re not. I guess a lot of times, especially in the band’s past we spoke a lot of truths. About love, fidelity, feelings. I think our real fans really know that about us. We seem to move something in them. I don’t know, I think a lot of people like us for the wrong reasons and hate us for the right, and vice versa. Some people just don’t know how to react to us. Most people react to something in a very linear fashion. Either they want to cry or they want to laugh, and I think when you’re listening to Type O Negative you should be doing both simultaneously. A tragic comedy. Either they love us or hate us or resent us. Whatever it is, they’re coming to see us.”

Sex Is Dead:

“It’s an outgrowth of my personal experience, which definitely is wrapped up in Type O as far as being on the road and fucking and travelling to nowhere…I look at the world, I consider humanity and when I think of people, I can’t describe them in any other way than horrible jokes for the most part. Life is tragic and ridiculous for the most part, and I’m afraid of it. I guess that Sex is Dead is an outgrowth of my own fear and confusion.”

The Role Music and Media Play In Today’s Society:

“Some of it’s good, and some of it’s crap. Some of it just adds confusion to the society. Some of it just reflects it in a sarcastic satire. Most of it is of no value though, especially the popular stuff which is usually the case. I mean, I don’t think anything real or dangerous has been done in a long time.”

“I think MTV and a lot of the bands on it have definitely raped this generation of most of their true identity. I think everybody wants to be something else or something else of another culture these days. I don’t know what the identity crisis is going on in America but I know that music isn’t helping it. ”

Origins and Fate of Type O Negative as per Kenny:

“I first joined because of Peter’s reputation. I wanted to see what he had coming. And when I heard the music and the lyrics, my intentions were just to be a part of it. And now, you know, I’d love to see it go on forever but I know it’s not going to. Everything has got to come to an end. We’ve got one more album left to do with Roadrunner, I don’t know what’s going to happen after that. Some of the members of this band are pushing 40. I hate to see anything end though, you know, when you have something that just works, it has something special in it sooner or later it’s got to come to an end, so I guess I’m trying to sustain it for as long as possible. ”

JH: Hey what’s up? It’s Jon from Dead to Fall.

MI: Hey what’s going on?

JH: Not much. Just woke up at 12.30. I’m a bum. I’m nocturnal though for the most part. I go to bed at 5am. We have practice in like an hour.

MI: What do u do, sir, ‘til such ungodly hours?

JH: Stay up late with the kids I’m staying with, they work nights so when they are off work we stay up hella late. Usually go out for a while, come home, look at girls on Myspace and watch videos on MTV.

MI: Alright, first of all, please describe your music to those who don’t know you.

JH: Mmmmm…that’s always tough for me a little but I would describe it as a hybrid of Swedish death metal, American metal, and hardcore I guess.

MI: Whom do you mainly listen to?

JH: I go in phases like most people I think

MI: What are your three top bands right now? Or three top of all time, or whatever you wanna say, not limited to three.

JH: Oh, I can’t do of all time. That would take me a week to figure out. But right now it’s Nile- “Annihilation of the Wicked,� Darkane – “Layers of Lies� (just saw them for the first time) and the Warriors – “War is Hell.�

MI: OK…what I mainly wanted to talk to you about was the whole concept of Villainy and Virtue. Did you ever hear of Orphaned Land?

JH: Nope.

MI: www.orphaned-land.com, check it…they have a song called “The Evil Urgeâ€?, it’s something in Judaism, basically that a person is born with a little angel and a little devil on the shoulder. Orphaned Land in this song states that the whole job is to strike a balance between the two (I don’t agree). Actually, before I get into my issue, could you just explain the whole thing of villainy and virtue as you see it?

JH: Well, when I was writing for the record I noticed that each song touched on the subject of villainy and virtue. Like some songs were more positive, some a little more negative. Each was a little piece of that inner struggle between good and evil.

MI: Can you give me a concrete example in one of your songs?

JH: Well, the opening track was about understanding your choices and where they come from. Knowing your mind, and letting it control your body. Understanding your choices, why you make them..etc. If you don’t know your own mind you make choices on instinct and gut reactions and in my mind that is not a smart way to live.

MI: Agreed. What’s the name of the track?

JH: Torn Self (Ready Set Circle Pit). It’s a little more positive. The title track is mainly about the religious right who are so concerned with everyone else, and with promoting what they think is the truth, that they themselves fall into what they preach against. So what they think is virtue turns out to be a deceiving form of villainy. I guess I see life has having necessary evils within ourselves. You have to know where they come from, and be able to control them. But they are necessary. So I would agree with what you said before about there being a balance.

MI: That’s so funny.

JH: What’s funny?

MI: I was taught that you have to uplift every type of emotion, no matter what (except anger and pride) and that they’re necessary evils, so to speak, but if you use them for the right it’s good.

JH: By whose opinion of right though? Because that’s all relative.

MI: Right. But who are you? Meaning what do you stand for, what do you believe in. Nobody can claim to be purely objective.

JH: No, but you can claim to be objective for yourself. By your own standards you decide what is right and what is wrong in each situation. Sometimes what is right by your mind and your ethics, everyone around you would call wrong. So what at that point is right and wrong?

MI: So I’m basically an Orthodox Jew. If I wasn’t religious there would be a lot of people I would murder just cause it would feel good. So my fight with people that don’t believe in G-d is: Who makes the ethics then?

JH: Culture.

MI: What culture? Homeboy ghetto culture that makes killing the coolest of the cool? There’s too many cultures to say culture.

JH: The culture that surrounds us tell us what is right and wrong, I don’t believe that we are born with a set of rules. It’s the people that surround them that decide what the rules are. I don’t know what that last comment meant.

MI: If you’re talking about being objective and you say culture makes the rules…here is an example. There are too many cultures that completely oppose each other, such as Western culture and Islam. To say culture, it’s too broad.

JH: Cannibal tribes in the bush don’t know that by Western religious standards the lives they live are wrong. I think that proves my point. Two different cultures that have two different sets of right and wrong.

MI: Right, but what I’m saying is, if that’s the case, then there has to be a code of ethics over that.

JH: Each culture has a code of ethics for sure.

MI: Each culture but they conflict.

JH: Most of the time it comes in the form of a god, because people are more willing to accept the laws of a higher power then the laws of their fellow man.

MI: For sure, why worship someone whose ways are intelligible to man? (Rav Kahane said that).

JH: There aren’t very many places that have gone untouched by Western (Christian) culture. As in missionaries who went out and preached that whatever those tribes were doing was wrong because it was wrong to Western culture. That’s what the missionaries in South America and Australia do.

MI: So you’re saying Western culture (a mix of monotheism and Greek philosophy) is the standard of the world?

JH: According to Western culture it is. That’s what the Crusades were.

MI: And are (what’s going on now is the same thing). There are a lot more Moslems though.

JH: And yes I think that the “war on terror” is the same thing. I only know the American perspective.

MI: I live in the Middle East so I get both. I think there has to be some sort of objective reality.

JH: This is not my opinion but the opinion of the masses, that we don’t understand the mindset of Muslims so therefore they must be wrong.

MI: Aaaaah, I can answer you but I can’t be objective about it. I mean, if I was a Moslem I would have totally danced when the World Trade Center fell, but because I’m an American-born Jew, I’m subjective. I can see why someone would have been a Nazi. Not saying because Jews are bad or something.

JH: I can as well, because going against the masses is hard. I am German-born. My whole family is German, and it’s a sore subject for most Germans and will be forever I think. Or another 250 years ‘til its just history.

MI: It can’t be.

JH: Well at this point it’s history, but not history that should be forgotten. And I think it’s good it’s still a sore subject so that we can’t let it happen again, although it happens.

MI: It’s not history for me. I live it every day. All my family was in the camps, and I know all the stories. It’s like, my sweet grandma who is the light of my life got her whole family gassed and cremated.

JH: Genocide in Africa is still happening but its not in oil rich countries so the rest of the world could care less. OK, back to our first topic of culture…

MI: I’m not throwing it on you, but you should know, like people are still really damaged.

JH: Oh, I know they are. I went to Dachau this winter when we went on a European tour. I wanted to go. I needed to be reminded that this shit really happened. From the moment I was born I learned about it. Because it is a big deal. I meant it’s a sore subject to Germans because we are embarrassed. Severely embarrassed.

MI: The thing is, some people say it’s because of the German culture, ‘cause there are a lot of things that Nazism appealed to. Lack of pride in losing the war (wound licking), Germans and failure don’t mix well. Bad economy.

JH: Yeah, and it was a gradual thing over a period of years. It wasn’t from nothing to genocide.

MI: But honestly, look, I’m glad many Germans (not all, mind you, whatsoever) are embarrassed. It doesn’t bring people back. But the thing is, I really think it could happen in America.

JH: I’m just being objective when I say Hitler was a good leader.

MI: Sure he was, he appealed to the most basic wants of humanity.

JH: Exactly. He was a swindler as well.

MI: Which is my point- it can totally happen anywhere.

JH: I agree. And a lot of Americans are scared of that as well.

MI: Part of the reason I left.

JH: W. has a lot of people caught up in this pro-America bullshit. So much so they dont notice things like Haliburton (Cheney, the Vice President’s old company) got a contract to help rebuild New Orleans without having to bid on it for something like $8 billion.

MI: Aaah it’s different I think- there’s a difference in being proud of your country and wanting to destroy an entire race.

JH: But it starts somewhere.

MI: Wow.

JH: It’s not on the news. No one cares. But it changes quickly.

MI: How did you know about it?

JH: A lot of my friends are in the unions here in the States, and are throwing a fit about it. It violates all kinds of labor laws, giving someone a no-bid contract. But OK, back to my pro-country stuff. I went to a lot of the pro-war protests just to hear people out and kind of get a feel for things. I was living in an average middle America town, about two hours from Chicago. So it’s not a suburb, just a country town where I was going to college. And it was right when the Iraq thing was starting. I heard people say ignorant mindless things like “Who gives a fuck, bomb them sand niggers.” “Fuck that Islam garbage, they only understand violence.”

MI: I dunno, I have a different take on it. I mean, I hear ya. But my best friend is from Iraq.

JH: OK I’m not saying that Saddam was good, he was a horrible dictator.

MI: Her gramma opened a photo album. She said, this one got hung from a fan, this one got shoved into a refrigerator, this one was killed this way, that way. Cause they were Jewish. I can’t be objective.

JH: But America must have learned nothing from Vietnam.

MI: What do you mean, what does Vietnam have to do with it?

JH: Another country where we went in like gangbusters and tried to help solve the world’s problems and had to fight guerrilla warfare. Yeah, the first war was won. But how do we keep fighting insurgents or whatever?

MI: Wait a sec. I understand why someone doesn’t want to have war. But remember I live in Jerusalem. The only time it’s quiet and we’re not getting blown up on busses and in pizzerias is when we go in there and kill the people doing it. When we’re nice and we give them it’s taken as weakness.

JH: And I’m sorry for that. Like I’m sorry that that’s how it is out there.

MI: It’s not as bad as they make it on the news, but I’m talking about attacks all over the country. Not your fault. But yeh, watch out that you’re not being subjective to your own morals. Your own morals, back to the culture, may be completely different morals.

JH: OK, but this is what I’m saying is my friends are over there fighting and getting blown up as well. And I don’t live in Iraq. And I’m not getting attacked. And I hope it doesn’t turn into Vietnam where we just got the shit kicked out of us, and many Americans died, and in the end, for nothing.

MI: Yeh, it’s a nightmare. But it’s like if they don’t take care of it there (and it’s debatable, whether or not that’s taking care of it but I don’t know enough about it to stand my own)-

JH: Yeah, it had nothing to do with Iraq –

MI: Where will they be taking care of it? But the World Trade Center, the Pentagon, they want you gone, bro.

JH: Because we want them gone.

MI: You say it has nothing to do with Iraq but I don’t believe that.

JH: There were no WMD’s and no one has held Bush accountable for lying to America. He told us that he had cold hard evidence that there was WMDs in Iraq and there weren’t. So now we are stuck in a conflict that a lot of Americans are not sure we can win. But back to the culture thing…

MI: OK. My stance is: cultures contradict one another, so to say, that culture makes the laws of true ethics can’t be true, cause each independent culture clashing leads to war. There has to be something over it, which leads to me believing in G-d, cause that idea supercedes plain old cultures.

JH: Right, but which god gets to be in control?

MI: There’s just one, and I’d bleed on that.

JH: But if you ask an Islamic person that what would they say?

MI: Might be many interpretations, but it’s the same One – Jews and Arabs believe in the same One.

JH: Yeah like by Ba’hai.

MI: A Jew doesn’t believe the Torah will ever be added to and that there were no more prophets after a certain time so Ba’hai gets shot down by me. Their gardens are out here in Haifa.

JH: Well, I was saying as far as saying that all religions are the same god, but by you…so by your culture/set of rules…

MI: Yeh, but I believe one of the worst concepts ever foisted upon mankind was the worship of objectivity uber alles which is a Western thing.

JH: Here are my beliefs. Ready?

MI: Go for it.

JH: Everyone is entitled to believe what they want. But no one should have the right to tell someone that their beliefs are wrong. Some people need religion and I respect that. I’m not going to tell them they are wrong. But the minute they tell me that I am wrong for what I believe is where I say something. The same: I’m vegan but I don’t preach it to everyone who eats meat. But when they tell me that I should eat meat and call me a “faggot” for not doing so is when I say something.

MI: That’s respectable… depends if it’s damaging you, or your circles or whatever.

JH: No, it’s more about that if someone wants to bring up the debate I’m willing to say something, but I’m not going out of my way to make drama.

MI: So this is what I wanted to argue with you about.

JH: Haha ok. Go for it.

MI: A virtuous man dreams what a wicked man does. Lemme ask, according to this, you believe all men are virtuous or wicked, it’s the same thing? Because of what’s going on in their hearts/minds?

JH: Mmm. I don’t think that men are one or the other. I think everyone has the capability for either. No one is inherently one or the other.

MI: So what do you think makes one virtuous or one wicked?

JH: The things that happen in our lives.

MI: That’s it?

JH: Our culture. And opportunity.

MI: So this is where i argue that you left out the most intrinsic element. CHOICE.

JH: Yeah, you have the choice to act on all those things.

MI: It’s about deed. If two men want to kill and one chooses not to he’s virtuous because his mind was over his heart and he controlled himself. (btw, it’s said that G-d created the man with his head over his heart, not like an animal, to show he has free choice and doesn’t have top be ruled by his instincts).

JH: What are the circumstances where two men had the opportunity to kill? Just for fun?

MI: Say each one could gain a million dollars for it. Could get out of it, so not be held to law or what people would say. No one would know. When someone goes against his personal desires for a greater good such as “I think it’s wrong to kill someone even for a million dollars.â€? And a million dollars is a primary goal in the society we were raised in.

JH: Well, I’m vegan so I would have to agree. I think its wrong to kill animals. However, a human has something an animal does not, the ability to decide to die.

MI: Or to live, or to let others be more important, when with animals it’s always kill or be killed.

JH: So if a human were to tell me they wanted to die so that I could eat them, that is something an animal cannot decide. It would be rather hypocritical for me to say that murder is ok when I think killing animals is wrong.

MI: Well, yes and no, cause you feel that animals are helpless against humans cause they’re small fuzzy bunnies but put your ass up against a lion and give you a gun I guarantee you won’t feel too much guilt.

JH: No, I feel that in this day and age I don’t need to eat meat anymore. The lion is life or death. My diet is not life or death. I haven’t eaten meat in ten years and I’m still alive. There is no need for me to cause the suffering of another living creature, but that is me. I am not willing to say that it works for everyone. Everyone has a choice and it’s up to them, not me. That’s my problem with religion. If someone believes differently they are wrong. There is no room for diversity of beliefs.

MI: Well, depends which, there can be diversity within a structure but yeh, some principles go untouched. Like, you can say you don’t want to believe in gravity but if you jump off a building you’re still gonna splatter.

JH: Unless you are on the moon where gravity doesn’t exist.

MI: This was the big fight of the Nazis with the Jews. Nazis wanted to be the human animals, all the power to be theirs, kill or be killed and use all of the talents given to them, divine talents, cause animals don’t have freedom of abstract expression or morality or all that, to further their own like, superman/animal bit. The Jews inflicted circumcision on the body and morality on the soul. That was the whole war, even leading Hitler to keep his efforts on killing Jews when he was losing in Russia.

JH: OK what are we talking about here, veganism, culture or WWII? One at time please.

MI: Sorry. It’s all part of the same. Objectivity vs. subjectivity. You’re talking about how you don’t want to preach to someone to be vegan and that you don’t think it’s fair that religion gives you principles that don’t allow for someone else to believe something else.

JH: Right…I just don’t feel right telling someone that their beliefs are wrong.

MI: Because you’re a prime product of liberal Western college educated culture, forgive me if I’m being presumptuous.

JH: No. Because I was Christian for 20 years. And I know me preaching to someone does nothing. I used to try and turn my friends on to the “truth”. And it never worked because unless someone has an interest to change then they aren’t going to. Someone has to have the desire to change. Same, preaching to people about their diet has no effect. However me living my life as an example of what I believe in could interest someone to ask why I’m vegan/straightedge and then I could have a civilized conversation with them about it.

MI: So why are you?

JH: Why am I what, vegan or edge?

MI: Both.

JH: Well, OK, veganism is a choice I made for my own health, and for the rights of animals and activism. That’s the short response. Edge is another form of activism I think. I live in a culture where alcoholism is rampant and by not drinking I put a small dent in an industry built on destruction.

MI: Also by not smoking (my friend died from it)

JH: Yes. The tobacco industry is the most destructive industry there is. Nothing positive ever came from smoking

MI: Yeh! yeh! Paying to die.

JH: Exactly. Smoking never saved anyone’s life. And they have so much influence. Tobacco influences so much of American politics so my choice not to participate is a little tiny voice saying fuck you to a giant.

MI: Heh, I bet you would have said no if you were in Germany then, you know? It’s the same mindset.

JH: I would like to think I would have.

MI: Aight well, this was definitely an elucidating conversation. I like Dead To Fall a lot, I like the way you blend styles and you’re fkn heavy, it was nice.

JH: Thanks, man. It’s hard to answer these questions over the Internet.

MI: Chat is good also though, cause it renders it impersonal enough that you don’t feel threatened.

JH: Haha true. Well, I am trying to make sure we have a date over there on our next overseas tour so hopefully we can meet someday. (talking about flights and expenses and stuff) I mean a flight from like Hungary to there wouldn’t be that bad.

MI: Nooo, also Prague is real cheap.

JH: Right, if we did it at the end of a European tour. I have to say my favorite food in the world is falafel so I would die.

MI: Hahaha. Why would you die from that (except for possible digestive issues)?

JH: Out of happiness. I’d eat it for every meal.

MI: That’s why you wanna come here??? Hahah it’s all about the pita n chummus man.

JH: Hahaha. Yeah I know. One of the reasons. I just want to play everywhere. And no bands go there so I think it would be rad.

MI: We have the best crowd, you should know. We’re fkn nuts but we’re happy too.

JH: That rules. Once our new record comes out –

MI: When is that?

JH: April. We’re recording in 2 weeks.

MI: Is it another concept album?

JH: Not so much.

MI: Not that Villainy and Virtue was so much of a concept album but it definitely was, sort of. It’s good music cause it makes you think, too.

JH: That’s good. I want that. So many bands don’t have shit to say anymore. I would rather incite conversation.

MI: Well, you just had an hour and a half of it, hahah.

JH: Exactly. I’m glad. Yeah. We’re coming over, I’m counting on it.

MI: Aight, we’ll see.

JH: Word. I’m gonna go get ready for practice and try to holla at this girl.

MI: Go holla. Yalla. Yalla is like, ok then let’s go. Also like, alright move it. Also like,
whatever.

JH: Haha

MI: Like u say yalla bye.

JH: Yalla holla holla yalla.

MI: Alright, Birth. Why do you call yourselves Birth?

DG: Just a cool name I guess.

LK: It started with two songs I wrote about cycles. Birth and then pain and death and birth. Dror liked the name of the song and then it became the name of the band … our previous logo and name were only temporary.

MI: What was the other name?

DG: Our previous name was Mental Infusion. It sucked.

LK: And then we sounded totally different. Back then I was way too deep into melodic shit and thrash, which is where I came from musically. After working with Dror I started to develop a new style.

MI: The world is repeating itself…can you elaborate on that?

LK: At the time I felt like all is stuck … no matter how hard you will try you will always come back to the same point. Back to the same old shit.

MI: Has that changed?

LK: I guess that a bit. Nowadays it’s just about doing our best and to try to be better … as humans, as players, as friends.

MI: Who’s in the band?

LK: At the beginning, wow, we had a lot of line ups. Dror is the one who always was
there. The line up is going to change soon … for a long time me and Dror been talking about bringing another guitar player. We found a really great one which played with us for one gig … the one with Betzefer … but since then we are thinking what is best … we are planning to audition some guitar players in the next weeks.

MI: Matan Cohen rocks.

DG: Matan? from Betzefer? Yeah, is a “kli!” Our current lineup: Lemmy-guitars, Noam – bass, Tomer – vocals and Dror (me) on drums.

LK: The best drummer in Jerusalem! He can also play circus music!

DG: Yeah well… just in order to make Lemmy go out of his mind.

LK: lol … you are playing way too much saka and shit or what ever you call that … music.

MI: So what do you guys call your type of music?

LK: Dror probably got some long names to describe it. I call it thrashcore.

DG: Well, thrashcore is much too specific. Most of our songs are a bit different from each other.

LK: I love a lot of different kind of music … what can I say?

DG: So I think it moves between death, thrash and metalcore.

LK: I think that also everybody in the band are bringing their own “thing” to the band so my riffs don’t sound too much like Sepultura or Slayer lol. We got a lot of the 80’s stuff mixed with a new wave of modern thinking …. a lot of that is coming from Dror.

MI: Do you have any music out online?

LK: We haven’t released anything yet.

DG: We are planning to record a demo soon… but according to now there is nothing.

LK: We got some live recordings but they sound like crap. We want to release something better … something listenable.

MI: You’ve been part of the Jerusalem metal scene a long time, no?

LK: Yep … I love this city. Been my hometown for the past 20 years.

DG: Yeah, the scene here is great. The people are much “warmer” than any city in
Israel.

LK: And here we also have a scene. In Tel Aviv its just people from all around the area.

MI: Matanya, can you describe a little about what you try to get across with your songs in the writing?

LK: Why to try when you can succeed?! When I write it’s usually for myself. When I am alone in my room I’m starting to let out all of my hate and anger … and sometimes music just comes to me. When Arafat died I was watching the T.V. holding a classic guitar. When he died I was happy but I was also very angry. I hated him so much I wanted him to die in suffers and tears. So I wrote a song that later became the song “Samara”. I write ideas which later on me and Dror are working on them. Then Noam is doing his part. Kinda like James and Lars lol. And lyrics … that’s Tomer’s job. I am letting him do what ever he wants. In this band we work that way. Every one has the freedom to do his own thing as long as it’s working good on the songs. But lots of the ideas and the rewrites are inspired from Dror’s drum lines.

MI: Awesome, is there anything else you wanna tell the world?

LK: Sason!

DG: Yeah, I agree with Lemmy.

LK: To the world?!

MI: Well, to the Internet. What’s Sason?

LK: He is the meaning of all life! lol he is some funny friend.

DG: Lemmy will speak for me.

LK: Well, I guess that I can say cheers! And that Jerusalem is the best place to be! Rock on!